Hi Joe
I have placed a new Homepage on the 1,100 year Milcentenary on the 
Internet, which talks of a lot of different aspects of the time and 
culture of the times. You may be interested in visiting it.
Fred Hamori
Fellow Southern Californian
my location is htt://exo.com/~fredh

Sorry for being out-of-theme or if this is a FAQ, I'd really
appreciate to know how to translate in your language the
sentence
"I love you"
(my girlfriend birthday is coming soon and I'm preparing a
poster with it written in all the languages of the world).

If your langauge uses special carachter sets please
send me a latin-font version or (if not asking too much)
an image (TIFF/JPEG) on how you would write it.

Warning: this message is cross-posted so please don't
overload the other groups posting followups and send
me E-mail instead (specify the language you are
translating to ! ;-)

Thank you very much.

Andrea.

Gotthard Saghi-Szabo  > wrote:

>Csak a pontossag kedveert,a BLA-t nem a HIX terjeszti hanem a 
>Hungary.Network, ami HIX Jozsi masik gyermeke (ambar, ezt is 
>HIX-nek hivja - Hungarian Information eXchange).

Igen, a Jozsi maga is felhivta figyelmemet erre, bar en nem tudtam, hogy
a Hungary.Network mogott is o all, de a HIX ujsagok es a BLA
fejlecenek hasonlosaga legalabbis azonos szoftvert sejtet.  Mindenesetre
arra meg nem valaszolt, hogy ki all a Hungary.Network mogott.

> En, szemely szerint sajnalom, 
>hogy a jelenlegi magyar intenet szolgaltatasok nagy resze egy olyan 
>oregedo, betokosodott, kommunista evek alatt felnott, arrogans es 
>rovidlato ember kezebe kerult mint amilyennek Hollosi tunik ritka, ambar 
>annal tobbet mondo hozzaszolasaibol. 

Ez egy kicsit eros meg nekem is, de talan megegyezhetunk abban, hogy itt
is egy tipikus Kadar Jugend jelenseggel allunk szemben.

Egyebkent Jozsi egy masik jelenseget is remekul demonstral viselkedesevel,
amit szinte minden Magyarorszagra latogato nyugati illetosegu eszrevesz.
Ez a tema a FORUMban felmerult tobbszor is az utobbi idoben pl.
olyanok tollabol, mint az NSZK-beli Andrea.  Igen, arrol a pokhendi
viselkedesrol van szo, amit szinte minden otthoni hivatalnok mutat az
ugyfelek iranyaban.  De nem csak hivatalnokok teszik ezt, hanem
egyaltalan mindenki, aki olyan helyzetben van, hogy masok raszorulnak
valamiben, legyen az bolti elado, vagy pincer.  Erre csak az a gyer
mentseg van, hogy itt nem egyedi magyar jelensegrol van szo, hanem a
"letezo szocializmus" vivmanyarol, ami ugyanugy, vagy megjobban letezik
a tobbi volt kommunista vezetesu orszagban.

Pannon J.

CRACIUN FERICIT ! LA MULTI ANI ! 
KELEMES KARACSONYI UNEPEKET ES BOLDOG UJEVET!
SRETAN BOZIC I SRETNA NOVA GODINA!
fROELICHE WEINACHTEN!
MERRY CRISTMAS AND A HAPY NEW YEAR

AND

PEACE ON EARTH!!!!!!!!
REGARDS,

In article >, Fred Hamori  > wrote:
>I have placed a new Homepage on the 1,100 year Milcentenary on the 
>Internet, which talks of a lot of different aspects of the time and 
>culture of the times. You may be interested in visiting it.
>Fred Hamori
>Fellow Southern Californian
>my location is htt://exo.com/~fredh

Thanks, Fred, I'll check it out.

Joe Pannon
a FORMER SoCal-ian

In article >, > writes:
> Path: 
news.pi.net!news.sara.nl!news.nic.surfnet.nl!howland.reston.ans.net!vixen.cso.u
iuc.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!EU.net!Portugal.EU.net!news.rccn.ne
t!newsfeed.sunet.se!news01.sunet.se!sunic!news99.sunet.se!newsfeed.tip.net!pero
ni.ita.tip.net!mikasa.iol.it!tiba16.vol.it!cocito
> From: Andrea Cocito >
> Newsgroups: 
soc.culture.kenya,soc.culture.korean,soc.culture.kuwait,soc.culture.laos,soc.cu
lture.latin-america,soc.culture.lebanon,soc.culture.liberia,soc.culture.maghreb
,soc.culture.magyar,soc.culture.malagasy,soc.culture.malaysia,soc.culture.mexic
an,soc.culture.mongolian,soc.culture.nepal,soc.culture.netherlands,soc.culture.
new-zealand,soc.culture.nigeria,soc.culture.nordic,soc.culture.pacific-island,s
oc.culture.pakistan,soc.culture.palestine,soc.culture.peru,soc.culture.polish,s
oc.culture.portuguese,soc.culture.puerto-rico,soc.culture.punjab,soc.culture.qu
ebec
> Subject: Please help translation (3 Words !)
> Date: 27 Dec 1995 20:50:37 GMT
> Organization: Nemesi
> Lines: 20
> Distribution: world
> Message-ID: >
> NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.166.53.20
> Mime-Version: 1.0
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
> X-Newsreader: Nuntius 2.0.4_68K
> X-XXMessage-ID: >
> X-XXDate: Wed, 27 Dec 1995 20:41:49 GMT
> Xref: news.pi.net soc.culture.kenya:14 soc.culture.korean:13878 
soc.culture.kuwait:2247 soc.culture.laos:1413 soc.culture.latin-america:5635 
soc.culture.lebanon:7787 soc.culture.liberia:43 soc.culture.maghreb:2989 
soc.culture.magyar:4687 soc.culture.malagasy:316 soc.culture.malaysia:14646 
soc.culture.mexican:8877 soc.culture.mongolian:720 soc.culture.nepal:2482 
soc.culture.netherlands:14554 soc.culture.new-zealand:13119 
soc.culture.nigeria:4300 soc.culture.nordic:11778 
soc.culture.pacific-island:141 soc.culture.pakistan:23929 
soc.culture.palestine:5362 soc.culture.peru:3517 soc.culture.polish:10928 
soc.culture.portuguese:10219 soc.culture.puerto-rico:6011 
soc.culture.punjab:10871 soc.culture.quebec:8592
> 
> 
> Sorry for being out-of-theme or if this is a FAQ, I'd really
> appreciate to know how to translate in your language the
> sentence
> "I love you"
> (my girlfriend birthday is coming soon and I'm preparing a
> poster with it written in all the languages of the world).
> 
> If your langauge uses special carachter sets please
> send me a latin-font version or (if not asking too much)
> an image (TIFF/JPEG) on how you would write it.
> 
> Warning: this message is cross-posted so please don't
> overload the other groups posting followups and send
> me E-mail instead (specify the language you are
> translating to ! ;-)
> 
> Thank you very much.
> 
> Andrea.
> 
hallo andrea,

in Holland we say : ik hou van jou
A nice idea to make such a poster!
groetjes = greetings  renee

Hello,

I was browsing newsgroups and noticed this one.

I have some postage stamps from the early 1970's with the name Magyar
Posta on them.  I never took the time to find out what area of the
world the stamps come from.

Would someone kindly supply some brief details and also let me know
where the stamps might be traded for value.

Thanks.

Leonard

In article >,
Andrea Cocito  > wrote:

>appreciate to know how to translate in your language the sentence
>"I love you"

I don't remember where I found the following, but it's exactly
what you're looking for.

*******************************************************************************
"I LOVE YOU" Around the World - c/o Are Thunes Samsonsen >
*******************************************************************************

Afrikaans    Ek is lief vir jou
             Ek het jou liefe
Albanian     Ti je zemra ime
Amharic      Afekrishalehou
Arabic       Ana Behibak (to a male)
             Ana Behibek (to a female)
Basc         Nere Maitea
Bavarian     I mog di narrisch gern
Bengali      Ami tomAy bhAlobAshi
Berber       Lakh tirikh
Bicol        Namumutan ta ka
:..:| ..:| |..-..   .::":.., :.:;    Braille
Bulgarian    Obicham te
Cambodian    kh_nhaum soro_lahn nhee_ah
             Bon sro lanh oon
Catalan      T'estim   (mallorcan)
             T'estime  (valencian)
             T'estimo  (catalonian)
             T'estim molt (I love you a lot)
Chinese      Wo ai ni (Mandarin)
             Ngo oi ney (Cantonese)
Croatian     LJUBim te
Czech        miluji te
Danish       Jeg elsker dig
Dutch        Ik houd van jou
Estonian     Mina armastan sind
Esperanto    Mi amas vin
Farsi        Tora dust midaram
Flemish      Ik zie oe geerne
Finnish      Mina rakastan sinua
French       Je t'aime
             Je vous aime
Friesian     Ik hou fan dei (sp?)
Gaelic       Ta gra agam ort
German       Ich liebe Dich
Greek        S' ayapo
Hausa        Ina sonki
Hebrew       aNEE oHEIVET oTKHA  (female to male)
             aNEE oHEIV otAKH    (male to female)
             Ani ohev at (man to woman)
             Ani ohevet atah (woman to man)
Hindi        Mae tumko peyar kia
Hokkien      Wa ai lu
Hopi         Nu' umi unangwa'ta
Hungarian    Szeretlek te'ged
Icelandic    eg elska thig  (pronounced "yeg l-ska thig")
Indian       Nenu Ninnu Premisthunnanu  (Telugu)
             My Tumse Pyaar Kartha Hun  (Hindi)
Indonesian   Saya cinta padamu
             Saya Cinta Kamu
             Aku tjinta padamu
             Saja kasih saudari
Italian      Ti amo
Irish        taim i' ngra leat
Japanese     Kimi o ai shiteru
             Aishiteiru
Kiswahili    Nakupenda
Korean       Dangsinul sarang hae yo
Kurdish      Ez te hezdikhem (?)
Latin        Te amo
             Amo te
             Vos amo
Lao          Khoi huk chau
Lingala      Nalingi yo
Luo          Aheri
Madrid lingo Me molas, tronca
Malaysian    Sayah Chantikan Awah
             Aku sayang enkow
Malay        Aku sayang padamu
             Aku cinta padamu
             Engkaulah permata hatiku
Mandarin     Wo ai ni
Mohawk       Konoronhkwa
Navaho       Ayor anosh'ni
Ndebele      Niyakutanda
Norwegian    Jeg elsker deg   (Bokmaal)
             Eg elskar deg    (Nynorsk)
Pakistani    Muje se mu habbat hai
Persian      Tora dost daram
Filipino     Mahal Kita
             Iniibig Kita
Polish       Kocham Cie
             Yacha kocham
Portuguese   Eu te amo
Romanian     Te iu besc
Russian      Ya lyublyu tebya
             Ya vas lyublyu
Scot Gaelic  Tha gra\dh agam ort
Serbian      LUBim te.
Serbocroatian volim te
Shona        Ndinokuda
Sioux        Techihhila
Slovak       lubim ta
Slovene      ljubim te
Spanish      Te amo
             Te quiero
Swahili      Nakupenda
Swedish      Jag a"lskar dig
Swiss-German Ch'ha di ga"rn
Tagalog      Mahal kita
Tamil        Nan Unnai Kathalikaren
Thai         Phom Rak Khun
             Ch'an Rak Khun
Tunisian     Ha eh bak
Turkish      Seni seviyurum
Urdu         Mujge tumae mahabbat hai
Vietnamese   Anh ye^u em   (man to woman)
             Em ye^u anh   (woman to man)
             Toi yeu em
Vlaams       Ik hue van ye
Welsh        'Rwy'n dy garu di.
             Yr wyf i yn dy garu di (chwi)
Yiddish      Ikh hob dikh lib
Yugoslavian  Ya te volim
Zazi         Ezhele hezdege (sp?)
Zuni         Tom ho' ichema

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

---------------------------------191652410612814
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

"Arpad F. Kovacs" > wrote:
>Quite by coincidence, I happened to see part of a CNN World Report about
>Rumania's new TV station, broadcasting news into neighboring countries.
>(Please see Reuters story of November 30.) The Rumanian reporter promised
>the station is and would be objective. 
>
>He then bemoaned the fact that in the neighboring countries Rumanian is
>regarded as a foreign language, even though those people, according to
>him, are descendants of Rumanians. ( I checked. I saw the broadcast on
>December 24, not April 1.)
>
>The "reporter" has a point, even if not the one he intended. There is
>historical evidence of contact if not kinshipexcept in the Christian
>sensegoing back centuries. 
>
>Those now calling themselves Rumanians, had been nomadic shepherds, slaves
>to Serbs and Romans. This was bound to affect their language. Respected
>linguists (of Rumanian and other nationalities) say almost half of all
>Rumanian words are of Slavic origin, less than a third Latin, and lesser
>percentages of Turkish, Greek, and Hungarian origin. What little written
>language existed, was in Old Church Slavonic using the Cyrillic alphabet;
>the conversion to the Latin alphabet occurred only in the nineteenth
>century. This was probably of little consequence, for according to
>former-Prime Minister Petre Roman, the people became literate only
>recently, under Communism. 
>
>Hungarian as a significant component of the Rumanian language is a product
>of its historical contribution. Throughout its 1,100 year history, Hungary
>had provided a safe haven to many peoples persecuted in their own
>homelands. In recent times, until occupied by the Nazis in March of 1944,
>Hungary provided safety for Jews from all over Europe. 
>
>Centuries earlier, nomadic shepherd first infiltrated and grazed their
>flocks in Transylvania. Eventually, having subsequently been given safety
>by the Hungarians, the ancestors of those today called Rumanians took many
>words that trace their origin to that time in history, about the 13th
>Century. Among them: the Hungarian word for admissionbefogadasbecame,
>"fagadui"; the Hungarian word for giving shelterszallasadasbecame
>"salasdui". 
>
>The names of towns, rivers, streams are all of Hungarian origin, adapted
>to make them easier for a Rumanian to pronounce. Also unchanged is the
>Rumanian word for Transylvania. It, too, is an adaptation of the Hungarian
>word, Erdely. 
>
>The name "Rumania" for the country is of fairly recent origin. These
>people had called their pre-Trianon territory Wallachia, and were
>themselves called Vlachs. In Transylvania, they had been considered a
>foreign element by Hungarian and Saxon alike, for religious and not ethnic
>reasons. They were adherents of the Byzantine rite church.  When Rumania
>was formed in 1859, it adopted the prevalent self-definition "Rumin" used
>by the Ottoman Turks to refer to the Byzantine empire and the Balkans. To
>this day, the Turks call Greeks and other adherents of that confession
>rumlar, or Romans. 
>
>At the time of the Reformation, their beliefs and practice were considered
>so strange to Catholics and Protestants alike, that they were considered
>non-Christian.  Attempts to convert these Rumanians/Vlachs had their own
>impact on literature and language. A catechism was commissioned and paid
>for by the Transylvanian city of Nagyszeben. It was translated and printed
>in Rumanian in 1544. A Rumanian religious convert named Coresi
>translated and printed the four Gospels in Brasso in 1561; by 1563, the
>rest of the New Testament had been translated and printed. The first Bible
>in Rumanian was commissioned by Gabor Bethlen and printed in 1648 under
>Gyorgy Rakoczi I. 
>
>Many new Rumanian words were to enter the language. To give some
>examples: the Hungarian terhes (burdensome) became taroasa; oka
>(cause, reason of/for) became oca; oltalmazni (protect, guard against)
>became otalmazui. 
>
>But history has been overtaken by present day exigencies and expansionist
>ambitions. To aid them, a Daco-Roman myth of ancestry has been invented.
>Absent what history can provide, evidence had to be created. 
>
>The Rumanian language has been enlisted in that drive and become
>dynamic, undergoing continual change. Every year words of Latin or
>French origin are substituted for Rumanian words in textbooks and
>elsewhere. In this way, over a period of years, the myth can be
>transformed and language used to show that Rumanians are of Roman
>origin. 
>
>If only all the changes in the present were so benign or confined to
>language. 
>
>But kinship has acquired a new meaning. For it, there were no pictures,
>there was no story showing just how hate now rewards hospitality. Nor the
>means chosen for its expression: a sophisticated form of ethnic
>cleansing, so called by Bishop Tokes, one of the heroes of the
>Revolution/Coup of 1989. It seeks first to kill the soul. 
>
>There was good news, though. A brief glimpse of the snow-capped mountains
>of Transylvaniawhere long-ago Rumanians sought and were given shelter,
>for themselves and their flocksshowed them to be beautiful. Still.


---------------------------------191652410612814
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN

Quite by coincidence, I happened to see part of a CNN World Report about
Rumania's new TV station, broadcasting news into neighboring countries.
(Please see Reuters story of November 30.) The Rumanian reporter promised
the station is and would be objective. 

He then bemoaned the fact that in the neighboring countries Rumanian is
regarded as a foreign language, even though those people, according to
him, are descendants of Rumanians. ( I checked. I saw the broadcast on
December 24, not April 1.)

The "reporter" has a point, even if not the one he intended. There is
historical evidence of contact if not kinshipexcept in the Christian
sensegoing back centuries. 

Those now calling themselves Rumanians, had been nomadic shepherds, slaves
to Serbs and Romans. This was bound to affect their language. Respected
linguists (of Rumanian and other nationalities) say almost half of all
Rumanian words are of Slavic origin, less than a third Latin, and lesser
percentages of Turkish, Greek, and Hungarian origin. What little written
language existed, was in Old Church Slavonic using the Cyrillic alphabet;
the conversion to the Latin alphabet occurred only in the nineteenth
century. This was probably of little consequence, for according to
former-Prime Minister Petre Roman, the people became literate only
recently, under Communism. 

Hungarian as a significant component of the Rumanian language is a product
of its historical contribution. Throughout its 1,100 year history, Hungary
had provided a safe haven to many peoples persecuted in their own
homelands. In recent times, until occupied by the Nazis in March of 1944,
Hungary provided safety for Jews from all over Europe. 

Centuries earlier, nomadic shepherd first infiltrated and grazed their
flocks in Transylvania. Eventually, having subsequently been given safety
by the Hungarians, the ancestors of those today called Rumanians took many
words that trace their origin to that time in history, about the 13th
Century. Among them: the Hungarian word for admissionbefogadasbecame,
"fagadui"; the Hungarian word for giving shelterszallasadasbecame
"salasdui". 

The names of towns, rivers, streams are all of Hungarian origin, adapted
to make them easier for a Rumanian to pronounce. Also unchanged is the
Rumanian word for Transylvania. It, too, is an adaptation of the Hungarian
word, Erdely. 

The name "Rumania" for the country is of fairly recent origin. These
people had called their pre-Trianon territory Wallachia, and were
themselves called Vlachs. In Transylvania, they had been considered a
foreign element by Hungarian and Saxon alike, for religious and not ethnic
reasons. They were adherents of the Byzantine rite church.  When Rumania
was formed in 1859, it adopted the prevalent self-definition "Rumin" used
by the Ottoman Turks to refer to the Byzantine empire and the Balkans. To
this day, the Turks call Greeks and other adherents of that confession
rumlar, or Romans. 

At the time of the Reformation, their beliefs and practice were considered
so strange to Catholics and Protestants alike, that they were considered
non-Christian.  Attempts to convert these Rumanians/Vlachs had their own
impact on literature and language. A catechism was commissioned and paid
for by the Transylvanian city of Nagyszeben. It was translated and printed
in Rumanian in 1544. A Rumanian religious convert named Coresi
translated and printed the four Gospels in Brasso in 1561; by 1563, the
rest of the New Testament had been translated and printed. The first Bible
in Rumanian was commissioned by Gabor Bethlen and printed in 1648 under
Gyorgy Rakoczi I. 

Many new Rumanian words were to enter the language. To give some
examples: the Hungarian terhes (burdensome) became taroasa; oka
(cause, reason of/for) became oca; oltalmazni (protect, guard against)
became otalmazui. 

But history has been overtaken by present day exigencies and expansionist
ambitions. To aid them, a Daco-Roman myth of ancestry has been invented.
Absent what history can provide, evidence had to be created. 

The Rumanian language has been enlisted in that drive and become
dynamic, undergoing continual change. Every year words of Latin or
French origin are substituted for Rumanian words in textbooks and
elsewhere. In this way, over a period of years, the myth can be
transformed and language used to show that Rumanians are of Roman
origin. 

If only all the changes in the present were so benign or confined to
language. 

But kinship has acquired a new meaning. For it, there were no pictures,
there was no story showing just how hate now rewards hospitality. Nor the
means chosen for its expression: a sophisticated form of ethnic
cleansing, so called by Bishop Tokes, one of the heroes of the
Revolution/Coup of 1989. It seeks first to kill the soul. 

There was good news, though. A brief glimpse of the snow-capped mountains
of Transylvaniawhere long-ago Rumanians sought and were given shelter,
for themselves and their flocksshowed them to be beautiful. Still.

---------------------------------191652410612814--

"Arpad F. Kovacs" > wrote:
>Quite by coincidence, I happened to see part of a CNN World Report about
>Rumania's new TV station, broadcasting news into neighboring countries.
>(Please see Reuters story of November 30.) The Rumanian reporter promised
>the station is and would be objective. 
>
>He then bemoaned the fact that in the neighboring countries Rumanian is
>regarded as a foreign language, even though those people, according to
>him, are descendants of Rumanians. ( I checked. I saw the broadcast on
>December 24, not April 1.)
>
>The "reporter" has a point, even if not the one he intended. There is
>historical evidence of contact if not kinshipexcept in the Christian
>sensegoing back centuries. 
>
>Those now calling themselves Rumanians, had been nomadic shepherds, slaves
>to Serbs and Romans. This was bound to affect their language. Respected
>linguists (of Rumanian and other nationalities) say almost half of all
>Rumanian words are of Slavic origin, less than a third Latin, and lesser
>percentages of Turkish, Greek, and Hungarian origin. What little written
>language existed, was in Old Church Slavonic using the Cyrillic alphabet;
>the conversion to the Latin alphabet occurred only in the nineteenth
>century. This was probably of little consequence, for according to
>former-Prime Minister Petre Roman, the people became literate only
>recently, under Communism. 
>
>Hungarian as a significant component of the Rumanian language is a product
>of its historical contribution. Throughout its 1,100 year history, Hungary
>had provided a safe haven to many peoples persecuted in their own
>homelands. In recent times, until occupied by the Nazis in March of 1944,
>Hungary provided safety for Jews from all over Europe. 
>
>Centuries earlier, nomadic shepherd first infiltrated and grazed their
>flocks in Transylvania. Eventually, having subsequently been given safety
>by the Hungarians, the ancestors of those today called Rumanians took many
>words that trace their origin to that time in history, about the 13th
>Century. Among them: the Hungarian word for admissionbefogadasbecame,
>"fagadui"; the Hungarian word for giving shelterszallasadasbecame
>"salasdui". 
>
>The names of towns, rivers, streams are all of Hungarian origin, adapted
>to make them easier for a Rumanian to pronounce. Also unchanged is the
>Rumanian word for Transylvania. It, too, is an adaptation of the Hungarian
>word, Erdely. 
>
>The name "Rumania" for the country is of fairly recent origin. These
>people had called their pre-Trianon territory Wallachia, and were
>themselves called Vlachs. In Transylvania, they had been considered a
>foreign element by Hungarian and Saxon alike, for religious and not ethnic
>reasons. They were adherents of the Byzantine rite church.  When Rumania
>was formed in 1859, it adopted the prevalent self-definition "Rumin" used
>by the Ottoman Turks to refer to the Byzantine empire and the Balkans. To
>this day, the Turks call Greeks and other adherents of that confession
>rumlar, or Romans. 
>
>At the time of the Reformation, their beliefs and practice were considered
>so strange to Catholics and Protestants alike, that they were considered
>non-Christian.  Attempts to convert these Rumanians/Vlachs had their own
>impact on literature and language. A catechism was commissioned and paid
>for by the Transylvanian city of Nagyszeben. It was translated and printed
>in Rumanian in 1544. A Rumanian religious convert named Coresi
>translated and printed the four Gospels in Brasso in 1561; by 1563, the
>rest of the New Testament had been translated and printed. The first Bible
>in Rumanian was commissioned by Gabor Bethlen and printed in 1648 under
>Gyorgy Rakoczi I. 
>
>Many new Rumanian words were to enter the language. To give some
>examples: the Hungarian terhes (burdensome) became taroasa; oka
>(cause, reason of/for) became oca; oltalmazni (protect, guard against)
>became otalmazui. 
>
>But history has been overtaken by present day exigencies and expansionist
>ambitions. To aid them, a Daco-Roman myth of ancestry has been invented.
>Absent what history can provide, evidence had to be created. 
>
>The Rumanian language has been enlisted in that drive and become
>dynamic, undergoing continual change. Every year words of Latin or
>French origin are substituted for Rumanian words in textbooks and
>elsewhere. In this way, over a period of years, the myth can be
>transformed and language used to show that Rumanians are of Roman
>origin. 
>
>If only all the changes in the present were so benign or confined to
>language. 
>
>But kinship has acquired a new meaning. For it, there were no pictures,
>there was no story showing just how hate now rewards hospitality. Nor the
>means chosen for its expression: a sophisticated form of ethnic
>cleansing, so called by Bishop Tokes, one of the heroes of the
>Revolution/Coup of 1989. It seeks first to kill the soul. 
>
>There was good news, though. A brief glimpse of the snow-capped mountains
>of Transylvaniawhere long-ago Rumanians sought and were given shelter,
>for themselves and their flocksshowed them to be beautiful. Still.

Oxymoronkent ismertuk mindig. Ertesultem rola, hogy megint 
(meg mindig) az. A Szabad Vilag intezmenyei kozt szerencsere 
helye van. Kar, hogy otthoniak, rossz beidegzessel, sokszor 
kirekesztik magukat ezek kozul.

Adjunk ha'la't erte, hogy a Szabad Vilagban vagyunk!

Pellionisz Andras

"Arpad F. Kovacs" > wrote:
>Quite by coincidence, I happened to see part of a CNN World Report about
>Rumania's new TV station, broadcasting news into neighboring countries.
>(Please see Reuters story of November 30.) The Rumanian reporter promised
>the station is and would be objective. 
>
>He then bemoaned the fact that in the neighboring countries Rumanian is
>regarded as a foreign language, even though those people, according to
>him, are descendants of Rumanians. ( I checked. I saw the broadcast on
>December 24, not April 1.)
>
>The "reporter" has a point, even if not the one he intended. There is
>historical evidence of contact if not kinshipexcept in the Christian
>sensegoing back centuries. 
>
>Those now calling themselves Rumanians, had been nomadic shepherds, slaves
>to Serbs and Romans. This was bound to affect their language. Respected
>linguists (of Rumanian and other nationalities) say almost half of all
>Rumanian words are of Slavic origin, less than a third Latin, and lesser
>percentages of Turkish, Greek, and Hungarian origin. What little written
>language existed, was in Old Church Slavonic using the Cyrillic alphabet;
>the conversion to the Latin alphabet occurred only in the nineteenth
>century. This was probably of little consequence, for according to
>former-Prime Minister Petre Roman, the people became literate only
>recently, under Communism. 
>
>Hungarian as a significant component of the Rumanian language is a product
>of its historical contribution. Throughout its 1,100 year history, Hungary
>had provided a safe haven to many peoples persecuted in their own
>homelands. In recent times, until occupied by the Nazis in March of 1944,
>Hungary provided safety for Jews from all over Europe. 
>
>Centuries earlier, nomadic shepherd first infiltrated and grazed their
>flocks in Transylvania. Eventually, having subsequently been given safety
>by the Hungarians, the ancestors of those today called Rumanians took many
>words that trace their origin to that time in history, about the 13th
>Century. Among them: the Hungarian word for admissionbefogadasbecame,
>"fagadui"; the Hungarian word for giving shelterszallasadasbecame
>"salasdui". 
>
>The names of towns, rivers, streams are all of Hungarian origin, adapted
>to make them easier for a Rumanian to pronounce. Also unchanged is the
>Rumanian word for Transylvania. It, too, is an adaptation of the Hungarian
>word, Erdely. 
>
>The name "Rumania" for the country is of fairly recent origin. These
>people had called their pre-Trianon territory Wallachia, and were
>themselves called Vlachs. In Transylvania, they had been considered a
>foreign element by Hungarian and Saxon alike, for religious and not ethnic
>reasons. They were adherents of the Byzantine rite church.  When Rumania
>was formed in 1859, it adopted the prevalent self-definition "Rumin" used
>by the Ottoman Turks to refer to the Byzantine empire and the Balkans. To
>this day, the Turks call Greeks and other adherents of that confession
>rumlar, or Romans. 
>
>At the time of the Reformation, their beliefs and practice were considered
>so strange to Catholics and Protestants alike, that they were considered
>non-Christian.  Attempts to convert these Rumanians/Vlachs had their own
>impact on literature and language. A catechism was commissioned and paid
>for by the Transylvanian city of Nagyszeben. It was translated and printed
>in Rumanian in 1544. A Rumanian religious convert named Coresi
>translated and printed the four Gospels in Brasso in 1561; by 1563, the
>rest of the New Testament had been translated and printed. The first Bible
>in Rumanian was commissioned by Gabor Bethlen and printed in 1648 under
>Gyorgy Rakoczi I. 
>
>Many new Rumanian words were to enter the language. To give some
>examples: the Hungarian terhes (burdensome) became taroasa; oka
>(cause, reason of/for) became oca; oltalmazni (protect, guard against)
>became otalmazui. 
>
>But history has been overtaken by present day exigencies and expansionist
>ambitions. To aid them, a Daco-Roman myth of ancestry has been invented.
>Absent what history can provide, evidence had to be created. 
>
>The Rumanian language has been enlisted in that drive and become
>dynamic, undergoing continual change. Every year words of Latin or
>French origin are substituted for Rumanian words in textbooks and
>elsewhere. In this way, over a period of years, the myth can be
>transformed and language used to show that Rumanians are of Roman
>origin. 
>
>If only all the changes in the present were so benign or confined to
>language. 
>
>But kinship has acquired a new meaning. For it, there were no pictures,
>there was no story showing just how hate now rewards hospitality. Nor the
>means chosen for its expression: a sophisticated form of ethnic
>cleansing, so called by Bishop Tokes, one of the heroes of the
>Revolution/Coup of 1989. It seeks first to kill the soul. 
>
>There was good news, though. A brief glimpse of the snow-capped mountains
>of Transylvaniawhere long-ago Rumanians sought and were given shelter,
>for themselves and their flocksshowed them to be beautiful. Still.