Roma Shot in Hungarian Restaurant/Disco
               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     According to an investigation by the Roma Press Agency or Roma Sajto 
     Kozpont (Budapest, phone, 36-1-217-1059, fax, 36-1-217-1068) on the 
     28th of July at 3:00 am in Pilisvorosvar (outside of Budapest), at the 
     'Red Castle' restaurant/disco, a young Romani (25 year old) father of 
     five children was shot to death. The Red Castle had hired new staff in 
     the past few months, and the young Rom, Sarkozi Joszef (Sanyi) began to 
     argue with one of the waiters.  The waiter called a security guard who 
     started to aggressively push Mr. Sarkozi.  Approximately 8 to 10 other 
     Roma intervened, and requested the guards to stop pushing him around.  
     Sometime after this, 3 back-up 'strongmen' were called to the 
     restaurant by the security guards, and after having a drink at the bar, 
     they asked the barman to point out Mr. Sarkozi.  The 'strongmen' then 
     proceeded to hit Mr. Sarkozi on the head with the butt of a gun; at 
     this point, the crowd reacted with concern and began coming closer to 
     the scene of the action.  One of the security guards shot in the air in 
     order to disperse the crowd.  When Mr. Sarkozi realized he was under 
     attack, he tried to escape, and at that moment he was shot in the head. 
     The police are trying to locate the murderer, Schaffer Zoltan, and his 
     two companion 'strongmen' have already been placed under arrest.  There 
     are approximately 50 witnesses to the murder.
-- 
Wally Keeler					Poetry
Creative Intelligence Agency			is
Peoples Republic of Poetry			Poetency

Maria Egorov ) writes:
> Reanalize your statement Mr.
> 

I did.
And you are Ms.

Maria Egorov ) writes:
> Just the spelling bothers you?

Obviously, your cowardice to address my replies to your postings bothers
you immensely. Forget the petty spelling, reply to something more substantial.

 wrote:
 
~ Just to get an idea what the Hungarian minority of Slovakia may be
~ facing in their 1,100 year homeland:
~ 
~ Joe Pannon
~ ----------------------------------
~ 
~ Article 20513 of bit.listserv.slovak-l:
~ From:  (Kristina Szurek)
~ Newsgroups: bit.listserv.slovak-l
~ Subject: Re: More paranoia from Bratislava
~ Date: 30 Jul 1996 13:44:26 GMT
~ Organization: York University
~ Lines: 35
~ Message-ID: >
~ References: >
~ Reply-To: 
~ NNTP-Posting-Host: sunlight.ccs.yorku.ca
~ X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]
~ 
~ : >SLOVAK GOVERNMENT APPROVES BILL ON STATE SYMBOLS. The government on 23
~ : >July approved a draft law on the use of state symbols, Slovenska
~ : >Republika reported the following day. If the bill becomes law, state
~ : >offices would no longer be required to display portraits of the
~ : >president. The bill would also prevent the public display of the
~ : >Hungarian flag in southern Slovakia except during official visits by
~ : >Hungarian officials. -- Sharon Fisher
~ 
~ I think that Hungarians living in Slovakia are having too much power
~ as a minority.  The international bounaries are set, and the land now
~ is under jurisdiction of the Slovak Republic, so if you live on this
~ land, you should conform to its laws.  I mean, the whole towns and cities
~ speak Hungarian, stores have only Hungarian signs, elementary and
~ secondary school are taught in Hungarian, and thoughts of Hungarian
~ university !?!  That's ridiculous!!!  No other minority in any other state
~ that I know of has such power.  

( ... rest deleted, it's in the same style ...)

There are several imprecisions in the Mr. Pannon's comment:              

Mrs. Szurek probably is not Slovak because of weak knowledge of          
basic facts about the country's realities. The name suggests a Polish    
origin.
                                                                               
She is not in Slovakia, as she is writing from a US university. Her      
contribution to the Slovak-L mailing list was appraised by an obnoxious        
 
specimen of Slovak fascist, if you are interested to know his name,      
come and read, you cannot miss him. There also is an another fascist     
who is a charming specimen, but actually fascists are heavily beaten
in a forum where only arguments and logic count. Unfortunately, this
is not the case outside of the Internet.

This is to say, please don't exaggerate.

Roman Kanala

 wrote:
> 
> Hi!
> 
> I've recently been talked to an acquaintance regarding the origin of the
> Hungarian people.  And from there we went through the usual ones about coming
> from Siberia, the Ural mountains, Sumeria, etc..  He however mentioned some-
> thing as well as a "theory" as crazy as it sounds about Hungarians originatin
g
> in Egypt!  Since I rather quickly dismissed this as a possibility and had nev
er
> even heard of it myself I tuned out rather fast.  Then when talking another f
riend
> of my she told me that her father also had heard of this and was rather convi
nced
> of this.  Since I haven't really gotten a chance to talk to these people sinc
e, and
> don't expect to for a while, I was wondering if anyone may have heard of this
> and if they have could they please explain how the heck this is possible?
> 
> Thanks,
> Peter
> 
> PS.  According to that theory we're not Mongols Ms Egorov :DJo napot!
I have not heard of this particular theory, however I read about a tribe 
in egypt the members of which claim descent from boys taken into the 
turkish army during the turkish occupation of Hungary and then settled in 
Egypt. This claim becomes plausible when the style of their houses an 
house decorations were studied.
I do not have details with me but can probably find out more if anybody 
is interested.
I have also a friend, a linguist who has worked on the theory that 
hungarian is related to japanes. Moreover a researcher in Japan has shown 
on the basis of biological testing that there is genetic connection 
between the two. Again I can supply more details.
regards
Denes

1996/7/31

 My name is Satoshi Natsume living in Sendai, a city in the northern
part of JAPAN. In my city Sendai, we celebrate a big festival called
the "TANABATA MATSURI" which concerns the Stars (See below). "TANABATA
MATSURI" is our biggest festival of the year and one of the most
famous festivals in Japan. We have been holding this festival for a
long time, and the origin of this festival came from an old Japanese
custom.

 We were organized named Sendai Tanabata Executive Comittee, in Sendai,
and opened home page on internet below URL to send the information of
"TANABATA MATSURI", old japanese custom.

    http://www.intercraft.co.jp/tanabata-1996/index_e.html

 We, here in Japan, have a custom during Tanabata period that people
decorate branches of a cut bamboo with strips of Japanese paper
called Tanzaku on which each person's wish or dream is written.
Now we have a special event that gives people all over the world
an opportunity to make your own Tanzaku.
 Please e-mail us your wish/dream that will be written down on
many Tanzaku to be decorated on the cut bamboos in downtown Sendai
city.
 Your dream may come true!  Looking forward to hearing from you soon.

    http://www.intercraft.co.jp/tanabata-1996/wish/tanzaku_e.html

        or e-mail to  on a form below.

--------
AGE:
NAME:
COUNTRY:
STATE:
E-Mail:
URL:
WISH:
--------

Please write your wish, and touch japanese old custom.
Our events begining at Aug 5 (Tanabata Festival starting night) will be
exciting. Enjoy!

Thank you and best regards.

---
Satoshi Natsume   
      interCraft Co., Ltd.  tel 08-22-217-8235 fax 08-22-268-2639
   Nitto Heights 804, Kokubun-cho 3-8-17, aoba-ku, Sendai, 980, Japan

Sendai Tanabata HomePage Executive Committee
    http://www.intercraft.co.jp/tanabata-1996/
    e-mail: 

---


        ===================================================
        ==== August 6-8 Tanabata, Sendai downtown Area ====
        ===================================================
 Tanabata is one of the three great festivals of northern Japan. Over
2 million visitors fill the city at this time of year to see the
tanabata which decorate the city.

 Tanabata evolved from a Chinese fairy tale (with a counterpart found
in Western tradition) in which two young people fall in love. A
weaver, daughter of a celestial king,fell in love with a handsome
cowherd and they marry, but the king disliked the way she neglected
her weaving and the way he neglected his herd. So he separated them on
opposite sides of the Milky Way and decreed that they could meet only
one night a year. On that one night, a flock of magpies came together
and formed a bridge with their wings so the princess could visit her
lover. It eventually came to be believed that they could meet every
year (usually July 7th) and only if the sky was clear. If it rained,
the magpies could not make their bridge and the lovers would have to
wait another year.

 To celebrate the event, the people of Sendai hang decorations of
strip of Japanese paper and origami on bamboo poles along the streets.
On Chuo-dori and Ichibancho huge tanabata ("star decorations") made of
paper and bamboo are hung above the streets. Slightly less
sophisticated tanabata are found on Nijunin-machi.

 There is a parade on the night of the 5th at 5:00 p.m. along
Jozenji-dori and fireworks on the night at Nishi Koen. But the
tanabata in the center of town are the main attraction. For a good
look at them, try early morning hours. But for mood, go later with the
crowds.


  ******************************
  **** TANABATA DECORATIONS ****
  ******************************

 The Tanabata Festival is most noted for its decorations and
traditionally each decoration has seven parts. The long colored-paper
streamers are called fukinagashi and they symbolize the threads which
the princess weaves all year long until she can meet her lover. A
small paper kimono, kami isho, is made by women to ask for greater
sewing skills and is also a charm against disease. Folded paper
cranes, orizuru, symbolize long life. Kinchaku, a kind of purse, is
made to bring increased wealth. Tanzaku are strip of paper on which a
poem is written, usually having to do with the Milky Way. A paper net
called toami is made to insure large catches of fish. A waste basket,
kuzukago, symbolizes the desire to save and economize.

 The more traditional tanabata can be seen in Nijunin-machi just east
of the station or in Aramachi. The more gorgeous ones along Chuo-dori
also require a lot of work and each one may cost from \150,000 on
up. Look carefully because no two are exactly alike and they are not
used again.


-------

Berry Rawlings > wrote:

>Lots of Asian girls who seem to be genuinely interested in making 
>friends with guys in the West.

To get out of poverty and put you into it.

Joe

Sorry if this post goes into the wrong place :)
But we're looking for a Hungarian au pair , male orfemale, to look after
out 2 kids 13 and 14 while we work .

Our previous au pair was Hungarian and a great success.


-- 
Dave

In article >,
 > wrote:
| Berry Rawlings > wrote:
| 
| >Lots of Asian girls who seem to be genuinely interested in making 
| >friends with guys in the West.
| 
| To get out of poverty and put you into it.
| 
| Joe

No.. to get out of one kind oof poverty and be subjected to
another.

Istvan

On 31 Jul 96 23:10:16 +0200, Peter Hakel > asks:

>On 31 Jul 1996, Roman Kanala wrote:
>
>> In fact, the issue in Slovakia is that the fascists are about to suppress
>> the natural right of Magyars, who unlike the Quebec francophones are not
>> intruders settled there some two centuries ago but original inhabitants of
>> their lands, to use their language on the territory that over centuries
>> was the land of their ancestors.
>
>  How long does it take for new settlers to be promoted from "intruders"
>to "original inhabitants?" I assume it's something between 200 and 1100
>years. What category do the Hispanics in America belong to? Their
>ancestors began arriving about 500 years ago.


Good question. If you take it this way, to the question which category
the Hispanics belong, I answer YES. Here is the explanation.

Let's define the term "intruders" as people who came without invitation
and unwanted. Then settled down and over years, they gained less or more 
legitimity to stay and to feel home. So let's consider a transformed 
problem: how long the time parameter has to be set ? 

To answer this question, one cannot give an answer by putting forward
a constant like 200, 500 or 1100 years. I think that we need a new
term, that I will call "decay of the legitimate interest". 

Indeed, a legitimate interest may become meaningless in various ways,
like when the object of the interest disappears or is altered in a way 
it's no more interesting. An example from the history: disappearing of 
the Babylon empire after the badly done irrigation increased the soil
salinity and the lands became irreversibly arid. Later, when men learned
how to take profit of the petrol, these lands became interesting again.

An another way the legitimate interest to decay is simply "expiration".
For example, if the owner of a building lets his good in hands of renting
people for too long, in some juridical systems these people may raise
claims concerning the right to use the building forever. It actually
happened in Czechoslovakia and to many people, it was one of the obstacles
to restitution of their confiscated property. In this case, the time
parameter was as little as fifty, fourty or even less years.

An another (yet not a different) issue are the compensations paid to 
the survivors among the deported Jews by today's Germany. In this case,
the time parameter has to be set to the lifetime of the victims.

How about the issue that brought me to develop this reflexion, the 
fascist Slovak State 1939-45, and the creation of Czechoslovakia 1918 ?
The 1918 events are so distant that there hardly are any survivors, but
the consequences of the inclusion of extensive Magyar-inhabited 
territories to what became Czechoslovakia are still present, courtesy
of Meciar and the Slovak National Party who broke the Republics and
now they do the same they disliked from Czechs to... Slovakian Magyars.

As a popular Slovak proverb says, the time will show. An another says, 
the time will heal everything. At the condition not to scrape scabs.

Yes the tribes that later formed the Magyar nation came to the 
Carpathian bassin after the Slav tribes, but when these have settled 
down they have also put under pressure the  Celts, who themselfs were 
audacious conquerors as they showed it to Etrusques in the Po valley.
So what? What's the connection to the these day's injustices in Slovakia?

Mr. Frajkor's amalgame between the events 1100 years ago, when Magyars
actually were intruders, 1000 years ago, when they definitely established
their kingdom, and the events at the end of the 20th century are a non-
sense, legitimacy of just anything from pre-1918 being definitely expired.

Roman Kanala

In article >,
Cours 6412 > wrote:
>How did those magyars managed to impose their language to a
>such overwhelming majority ?

This is due to a little known fact: that actually, the magyars are from the 
planet Zog-3, from the Gworzak stellar system. Over 1000 years ago, giant
pterodactyls delivered them to Earth.
They were deployed in the Carpathian basin. Using their nefarious mind
scrambling powers, the magyars managed to impose their language, and their
version of their origins, on the locals.
Thus, it was actually quite easy and painless.

>Why didn't happen the same thing as with the bulgars ?

See above.

>Genuinely curious,
>
>Cristian Alb

Gabor
aka. Bird Jaguar, Lord of the Mayas at Yaxchilan